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In response to Paul T. Kershaw's posting on gender and periphery: The use of pluralized _women_ in constructions such as _women doctors_ has some parallel in a similar use of _men_. Compare _women-folk_, _men-folk_; _women friends_, _men friends_. Even _men doctors_, though not usual, would be acceptable. There is also a series after the pattern of _gentleman-farmer_ (1749) (gentleman-commoner, gentleman-rider, etc.) that are all pluralized in both constituents: _gentlemen-farmers_, etc. Using _women_ to accompany a professional designation normally or formerly reserved to men has a long history in English. The following attestations come from the OED (2nd ed., 1989): wymmen syngers 1382, woemen officers 1494, women ministers 1577, women doctors 1622, women-actors 1632, women-Anglers 1661. Other interesting early attestations are: women saints c.1610, women slaues (=slaves) 1614, and without pluralization: woman-physician 1533, woman-surgeon 1628. Compare _man nurse_ (1530). Using preposed _woman/women_ and especially _man/men_ in all sorts of metaphorical, fantasmagorical and teratological concoctions also enjoys a long history: man-devill (1600), man-Monster (1611, Shakespeare), Men-monster Manglers (1632), men-cattle (1814), men-sphinxes (1864), man-dog (1884), men-machines (1904), etc. The origin of the double pluralization, which is not permitted elsewhere, is an interesting puzzle. Though such double pluralization would be usual for French, the first possible foreign influence that comes to mind, it is unlikely that French is the source since parallel formations in that language didn't really become widespread until the 19th century, when the fantasmagorical varieties started appearing: hommes-oiseaux (1828), homme-loup (1831), hommes-chevaux (1862, Hugo), homme-chien (1873), femme-sirene (1885). In the twentieth century, this procedure was recruited to add designation of female gender where needed: une femme-medecin/des femmes-medecins. As shown, the addition of preposed _femme_ converts the whole costruct to feminine grammatical gender. In only a few cases does one find variation with a postposed version: une femme professeur, un professeur femme. The only earlier use in French has to do with double +human appositions and human + divine appositions: homme-femme (=androgyne, 1569), femme-fille (1759), homme-dieu (1797). Getting back to English pluralization, it seems to me that the irregularity of the English plurals _women_ and _men_ is relevant. Since English also allows compounding by adjunction of the possessive case, to allow double pluralizations generally would lead to structural confusion: cf. boyswear, *boys friends. The exception to this is in those cases where an irregular plural obtains that does not require /-s/ adjunction. Thus _menswear_, (not *manswear) _men friends_, because genetivity and plurality do not have overlapping surface representation. So what about _child prodigies_? Should *children prodigies have been acceptable according to my logic? Well, first off the linguistic legacy is different for _children_ which hasn't had the same combinatorial precedent handed down, perhaps partly because _childer/children_ has been less stable over the centuries, the latter finally winning out by analogy to _men_ & _women_. Also, for purely pragmatic reasons there has been far less historical need for compounds involving _child/children_ in both artistic and professional vocabulary. _Child prodigy_ comes with other baggage. It has lexicalized as a compound in a way that _woman doctor_ has not and this is an added factor inhibiting pluralization in a language like English where, for reasons possibly related in part to the foregoing, compound-internal pluralization is not allowed (this is not a universal, in French is it allowed for these kinds of compounds: enfants prodiges). Still, it seems to me that _children_ enjoys more liberty in combination with other nouns than do, for example, _girls_, _boys_, _ladies_, etc. where there is /-s/ adjunction. One might invent _children folk_ and _children friends_ but never *boys folk, *girls folk, *ladies folk, *boys friends, *girls friends, *ladies friends. Michael Picone U AlabamaMail to author|Respond to list|Read more issues|LINGUIST home page|Top of issue